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CHRISMUR Profile
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Date Registered: 10-2010
TOTAL POSTS: 64
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Exhaust Problem - What is `Front Cat. Manifold` - Cost = £1000.00 ???


"Hello" - I am a new Member and I drive the Xtrail 2.0 SE [2WD] - I have just purchased the Xtrail
- a couple of Months ago - Today I was looking under the Front of my vehicle when I noticed that
what looks like the Exhaust Connection Pipe [Sorry about the Terminology] to the Engine - was very Rusty.

I want to look after the Xtrail - which is in very good condition [?] - So I enquired over the Phone
as to the approx. cost of what I tried to describe to the Exhaust Centre.

I was told that what I had described `sounded like` the `Front Cat. Manifold` - which would cost
£900.00 [UK Sterling] - and probably a `Front Small Pipe`- cost £73.00 -- Nearly £1000.00 !!

I am NOT at all knowledgeable about Vehicles - Obviously I will have to take the Xtrail into [another] Exhaust Centre to get it actually `Looked At`- up on a `Lift` - and I would `Shop around` for other Prices.

I tried to `View` the part mentioned - `Front Cat. Manifold` - BUT - it seems that although I have
a `Workshop Manual` on DVD - it is a USA Version [from ebay] - I cannot see ANY mention of
such a part on the Exhaust Diagram.
I know that versions of a vehicle DO differ in other Countries - BUT - would an Expensive/ Necessary part of the Exhaust really be `not required` on a USA Xtrail ??

Can I ask my `Xtrail owning colleagues` for their opinions on what I have described - I am very
`puzzled` as to WHY the part is not on the USA Workshop Manual Exhaust Diagram - AND How
an Exhaust Componant - IF it is a `Valid` part - could COST such Figures for this type of Vehicle ??

In advance of my `further investigations` - I would really appreciate your advice on this - "Thanks"

I am not sure what the `Conversion Rate` is for £1000.00 Sterling - would it be approx. 2000.00
Australian Dollars ??

P.S. Although I am not knowledgeable about Vehicles - I can/do read Drawings/Diagrams -
If anyone can `Post` a Diagram of the Xtrail 2.0 SE - 2006 - [Petrol] - I would be VERY grateful.
especially if it shows the `Front Cat. Manifold` - ??
21/Oct/2010, 5:52 am Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message Blog
 
jalalski Profile
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Date Registered: 02-2004
Location: SUTHERLAND, SYDNEY
TOTAL POSTS: 29094
Reply | QUOTE
Re:


Hi Chris,

What you saw under the car is just a flexi pipe connection which connects the manifold to the exhaust system pipe under the car. It is quite common for all exhaust system piping and components to develop surface rust as mild steel used in its construction. It doesn't affect the performance of the exhaust system at all, so there is no reason to replace anything unless a leak has been identified.

What the Nissan dealer quoted you on is the front manifold which has the pre-catalytic converter built into it and yes, it's an expensive part.

You won't find any information about the xtrail from the US as they don't have xtrails there.

Please browse through the Hi-Tech exhaust thread and you will see pics describing each exhaust component clearly.

---

21/Oct/2010, 7:01 am Link to this post Send Private Message MSN Blog
 
CHRISMUR Profile
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Date Registered: 10-2010
TOTAL POSTS: 64
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Exhaust Problem - What is `Front Cat. Manifold` - Cost = £1000.00 ???


"Hi Jalalski", Thanks for your reply - I realise that you have expert knowledge about Xtrails - I
did not explain my Exhaust `problem` in enough detail.

I have managed to have a `better` look - when I first looked I was not dressed to lay down on
the ground - but basically what I first saw is the same:

The section of the Exhaust that I see from looking from the front - between the wheels - is what
looks like a `Junction` piece - with bolts - transitioning from the Vertical with a [solid] pipe
from there going backwards to join the rest of the Exhaust.
I am not seeing any Flexible section of pipe in that area - also I know that the Exhaust will `rust`
underneath the car - just because it it of metal construction - what I see is almost a hole.

The horizontal piece of pipe is `Rusted` to such an extent that if I `prodded it` with my finger - a
hole would appear - that is why I know that this `section`[?] at least will need almost immediate
replacement.

My comment about my copy of the Xtrail Workshop Manual being an American version was because
I purchased it on ebay from an American seller and it was sent from the USA - also it refers to the
left hand drive version - which would have never `mattered` to me as I can easily see items in a
`mirrored`view.
Also it refers to `Muffler` - we call these `Silencers` - I thought that `Muffler` was a US term ?

In the last couple of Months I have been `online`looking at various information on Xtrails,
I definitely came across an `American Xtrail Owners` Forum - that in conjunction with what
I explained above is what made me believe that I had a USA version of the Manual.

I hope that I have not made this explanation too `long` - Today after reading your `Post` to me
I looked in the Workshop Manual DVD - in the Engine section - I found Diagrams for the Exhaust
Manifold and 3 Way Catalyst - That item must be what the Exhaust Centre have quoted for - and
the `part` that you mentioned - "Thanks` for the `nudge`in the right direction.

I don`t know WHY I did not look at the Engine Diagrams previously - I just looked at the`Exhaust`
section - and completely missed the fact that the Exhaust Manifold and 3 Way Catalytic Converter
would be `classed` as Engine Parts.

To `sum up` - I was shocked by what I was Quoted by the Exhaust Centre - from MY explanation,
I tried to see the `Expensive Part` in my Xtrail DVD Workshop Manual - No - I found this Forum and
Registered - Gained Membership and `Posted` my problem - You replied to me and your explanation
`nudged` me to look at the part that you mentioned - on the Engine Diagrams - I found that - It
looks very expensive - BUT I am now `reassured` that the `Exhaust Manifold & 3 Way Catalyst` is
NOT what needs replacing - That must be what was Quoted for. [?]

"Thank you very much Jalalski" - I am now `less worried` that I will have to spend such a large
amount of money on my Exhaust - what I saw as almost `rusted through` must be a section of
pipe - hopefully NOT expensive.

I really appreciate your help and I am `glad` that I became a Member of the Forum.

This is a very long `Post` - I will try to keep others shorter.

Apart from the VERY HELPFUL `Post` from You Jalalski - I have also found the answer to a
`problem` with the Power Socket Fuse on my Xtrail - Identifying which one it is - I have
been looking again in the DVD Workshop Manual - at the Wiring Diagrams etc. - Those seemed
to show that these Power Sockets were `wired` with the Cigar Lighter - BUT mine was stll
working - the Power Sockets are not.

I found a `Post` about the Fuse and the Answer - with Diagrams - Of course I will have to
`Check` IF the nominated Fuse [ No. 23 - 15AMP] IS correct for my Xtrail Model & Year - BUT
`hopefully` it is [?].


So "Thanks again" - "Regards" to my fellow Xtrail Owners, CHRISMUR.

22/Oct/2010, 1:57 am Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message Blog
 
CHRISMUR Profile
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Date Registered: 10-2010
TOTAL POSTS: 64
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Exhaust Problem - What is `Front Cat. Manifold` - Cost = £1000.00 ???


"Hi Jalalski", I have just followed your suggestion and looked at the High Tech Exhausts - your
`Post` on your Exhaust replacement was very interesting - I noticed that your system is NOT
anything like the Diagram of my Exhaust System.
The pictures show the sections of the system - The `Extractors` and the `Catalytic Converter
are separate items on your Exhaust system.


From looking at the Diagrams that I mentioned in my earlier [Today] Post - Engine Diagrams for
my Xtrail 2.0 SE - 2006 [2WD] - I can see that what is called the `Exhaust Manifold and `Three
Way Catalyst` is one unit [looks like] on my type of Exhaust system.

What You describe as the `Extractors` [4 Pipe assembly] are combined with a `Rugby Ball` shaped
`chamber` - housing the 3 Way Catalytic Converter - On my version of the Xtrail, That will be the
reason that I have not got a `Flexible` section of exhaust pipe where you were suggesting - my
type of system is totally different.

I am `intrigued` as to the `BIG` difference in design on our respective exhausts - and I am further
`worried` about comments that I have read here about the `Ceramic Catalytic Converter` failing`
and fragments getting into and Damaging the Engine !!
I wonder if that `problem` applys MORE to the type of Exhaust that I have - where the `3 Way
Catalyst` is much closer to the Engine ??

IF I knew HOW to `Post` a Diagram of my type of Exhaust System to this I would add it - but I
am `no expert` in Computing - and I don`t know how to - Also I cannot imagine that anyone
would want to look at Diagrams of am Exhaust system ??

I hope that I am not going to be perceived as `Anal` on this - Before I had the `problem` with my
Exhaust I would not have given a `second thought` to varying types of Xtrail Exhaust Systems !!


"Regards", CHRISMUR.
22/Oct/2010, 3:10 am Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message Blog
 
jalalski Profile
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Date Registered: 02-2004
Location: SUTHERLAND, SYDNEY
TOTAL POSTS: 29094
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Exhaust Problem - What is `Front Cat. Manifold` - Cost = £1000.00 ???


Hi Chris,

I think you are getting confused by the different terminologies used for the exhaust system you are coming across emoticon

First of all and based on what you have described, your 2.0LT xtrail must be the face-lift model and if that is the case, you would only have TWO catalytic converters in your car, which is part of the manifold (also known as extractors) as seen in this pic below:

Image

Image

That fat part of the manifold is the 3-way catalytic converter and the wire sticking out is the O2 (Oxygen) sensor. This is the first cat. converter.

The second catalytic converter would be under the car and it's situated directly under the driver's seat as seen below if you are to look under the car:

Image

The flexi pipe I was referring to connects between the first flange of the manifold to the rest of the exhaust system pipes as seen in this pic:

Image

As you can see that first section is covered by a heat-shield, so if that is the part that has rusted and you can poke a finger through it, it's not a big problem and the heat shield can be replaced without touching the exhaust system.

ALL model xtrails have a ceramic core cat. converter and yes it is a potential threat and can disintegrate causing flakes of the ceramic core to get into your engine and damage the cylinder walls, but having said that, there are 2001 model xtrails on the road still with the factory ceramic cat. converter without any problems, so it's a hit and miss type of thing and depends if the car is driven under heavy load all the time.

I can assure you that there are NO x-trail is the US, so the forum you have come across might have been a Canadian based one.

HINT: Please try and cover one topic in your posts rather than talk about fuses and power sockets in a thread that is now dedicated to information about exhaust system, this makes your posts shorter and it will also be less confusing to future readers who might benefit from your questions and the answers given if they're to perform a search within the forum.

P.S. Please refer to the welcome note posted to you when you joined the forum and check out the forum guides on how to post photos and diagrams, so you can practice doing the same when needed.

---

22/Oct/2010, 5:09 am Link to this post Send Private Message MSN Blog
 
CHRISMUR Profile
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Date Registered: 10-2010
TOTAL POSTS: 64
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Exhaust Problem - What is `Front Cat. Manifold` - Cost = £1000.00 ???


"Hello Jalalski", Thank you very much for the information and the `Great` Pictures.

You are correct in stating that you think I am getting confused with the various terminology that
I am `coming across` - When I saw the Diagram that I previously referred to - Engine Diagram -
I DID think that the `Exhaust Manifold and 3 Way Catalyst` INCLUDED the Catalytic Converters
- 3 of - in the `bulbus` section that I described as `Rugby Ball` shaped.

My Xtrail is the 2006 2.0i SE 2 Wheel Drive - Perhaps this Model is not sold in Australia - but
I`m sure that what you have stated is still exactly correct.



I would have liked to have shown that Diagram here but although I DID look at the information that
you suggested - I could not work out IMMEDIATLY how to `Post` an `Open` File containing the
Diagram - I will try to `Learn` how to do so for the future - anyway I am CERTAIN that You do
NOT need to see what I `misunderstood` !

Regarding NOT writing about `Other` topics during a `Post` - I wrote that I had found the Forum
`Immediately Helpful` - BECAUSE I had found the `Other` Post.

I apologise if I seemed to be `Breaking the Rules` - I KNOW that I should NOT write about more
than one topic during any `Post` - I was complimenting the Forum - I NOW realise that I should
have gone to the `New Members` section and then `Posted` my `other find` and Compliments
there.

"Thank you Jalalski" - for the time that you have taken to Post Information for me - I really
appreciate being able to correspond with an Expert on Xtrails.


"Regards", CHRISMUR.

Last edited by CHRISMUR, 22/Oct/2010, 8:00 am
22/Oct/2010, 7:56 am Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message Blog
 
jalalski Profile
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Date Registered: 02-2004
Location: SUTHERLAND, SYDNEY
TOTAL POSTS: 29094
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Exhaust Problem - What is `Front Cat. Manifold` - Cost = £1000.00 ???


Hi Chris,

Although Australia didn't import the 2.0LT T30 x-trail, the exhaust system and components are exactly the same between your engine QR20DE and the 2.5LT xtrail we have here with the QR25DE engine.

The diagrams you wanted to show me are these I bet (click on the photos to view them in full size)

Image

The above pic shows the manifold and the 3-way catalytic converter (we call it 1st cat. converter for easier reference)

The following diagram shows the rest of the exhaust components on your xtrail:

Image

I hope the above diagrams along with the photos I posted of the actual exhaust system makes it clearer for you. If still in doubt, please don't hesitate to ask, as I would hate to see you spend money on fixing something that has no impact on the performance of your car.

Thanks for the compliment regarding the helpfulness of our forum and as you said, it would be better to post those compliments in the existing threads where you found the information, as it will help others just like it helped you.

Also, we do have a Members Test section where you can practice your skills on uploading photos and things like that and the members as well as myself will be able to help you out until you feel comfortable.

---

22/Oct/2010, 8:26 am Link to this post Send Private Message MSN Blog
 
CHRISMUR Profile
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Date Registered: 10-2010
TOTAL POSTS: 64
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Exhaust Problem - What is `Front Cat. Manifold` - Cost = £1000.00 ???


"Hi Jalalski", Thank you very much for your reply - The Diagrams that you Posted were the
EXACT Diagrams that I had tried to Post in my last submission.

Corresponding with you HAS saved me further `worries` regarding a `Huge amount` of money
needing to be spent [for an Exhaust repair] - Between reading your advice - viewing the Photos
that you Posted and finding the appropriate ENGINE Diagram [`Nudged` to it by You] - I have
managed to `eliminate` the `Exhaust Manifold & 3 Way Catalyst` as what needs to be replaced.

In Fairness to the Exhaust Centre - they quoted from what I had told them - without finding the
relevent Diagrams first - I had said something along the lines of: The `Rusted` item is the
`First part - from the Engine` - I was thinking that as I could see that it looked like the First Pipe
section under the car - that description would enable the `Exhaust Experts` to know which section is was - Unfortunately it did not - they obviously took `First Section` to mean `Exhaust
Manifold & 3 Way Catalyst` - Which I suppose IS Correct.

The `Upside` of the `Expensive Quote`was that I found THIS FORUM ! - I am sure that I would
have been `searching` online at some stage and `come across` this Forum - but I am glad to
NOW be a Member.

I would never have just taken my Xtrail into that Exhaust Centre and told them to `Do what you quoted for` - and I HOPE that when the vehicle was up on the `Lift` it would have been `clear`
that the Expensive part was not what was required - BUT - as the item would have to be `Ordered in` - I wonder if the Exhaust Centre WOULD have been `Honest` with someone who
DID just say `Do what you quoted for` ??

Even now that [with your help] I have managed to `rule out` the Expensive part - I will still go
to an Exhaust Centre and ask for an `Exhaust Check` - where the vehicle will be `Lifted` and I
can be SHOWN the `defect [s]`.

Although I am NOT knowledgeable on Motor Vehicles - I AM a `Technically Minded` person - I am
a Heating Engineer - FULLY QUALIFIED in Plumbing, Heating and Gas Technologies and Registered
with the various Industry Bodies. - mentioned because plenty of people `Call` themselves
Plumbers or Heating Engineers.

I will try again to `Learn` how to Post Diagrams on here - although I cannot at present work out
HOW to `Post` something from my FILES ??
I will TRY to ensure that I can create a File with a http:// reference - and hope that allows me
to `Post` the item on this Forum. [?]

When I was mentioning that I thought that I had a USA version of the DVD Workshop Manual for my Xtrail - Since reading what you told me about the USA NOT having Xtrails - I have found out that the Manual [DVD] DID originate from Canada - as You suggested - "Thanks".


I really appreciate your help Jalalski - "Thank you so much", CHRISMUR.


P.S. Sorry that my paragraphs are `disrupted` - I did not have time [now] to `Edit` them.
23/Oct/2010, 3:43 am Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message Blog
 


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