Runboard.com
Слава Україні!
Australian X-Trail Website Members Rides

Site Search

Facebook Aussie Forum Website Twitter Aussie Forum Website YouTube Aussie Forum Website Flickr PhotoBucket MSN Messenger Skype RSS Feed Events Calendar Admin Mailbox Nissan Australia myNissan Capped Service Fuel Consumption Monitor Tyre Size Calculator Australian X-TRAIL Forum Live Chat

Forum Rules   
   Register for a free global account (learn about it) | LOG IN: globally (click here) (Lost Password?)




Page:
 1  2  3 ... 5  6  7  8  9 ... 23  24  25 

 
cooch t31 Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

X-TRAIL HOLIC
 


Date Registered: 06-2008
Location: Blue Mountains, NSW
TOTAL POSTS: 5966
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Particulate filter error resulting in MIL light


Dronus
Tried clicking on your picture to view the little symbol but it won't open up.
I bet you literally saw your past troubles flash before your eyes.

---
Tony X-891c

HERE is my D22 Navara
HERE is my old 2008 T31, ST Series1

27/Apr/2009, 5:53 pm Link to this post Send Private Message
 
cartsT31 Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

X-TRAIL NEWBIE
 


Date Registered: 09-2008
Location: Kings Park, NSW
TOTAL POSTS: 28
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Particulate filter error resulting in MIL light


Like you have already pointed out, simply taking the car on a long drive without knowing the status of the DPF is plain stupid. In essence, you are costing yourself on 2 fronts. If you are simply going for a decent drive to allow the DPF to regenerate without the DPF light on, you are using fuel you would not normally need to use. If you do it too often, you may be driving it unnecessarily without the ECU wanting to do a regen burn.

To put it simply, if you go for a highway run because you "feel you should" because Nissan say "its necessary for a regen burn" you cant tell whether you are doing the car a benefit or hinderance. Lets just say your dpf is 35% blocked, no where close to needing a regen cycle, and you then go and drive it for 300km for a decent run, and you get home thinking you have just cleaned the system out, but in fact the dpf is now 85% clogged because the regen conditions havent been met because the ECU doesnt think its necessary. You then sit in stop start traffic under conditions non favourable for regen, the dpf light will come on. So for all your good intentions, you would have been better to leave the car in the driveway. Now you have just cost yourself a trip to Nissan to force a regen.

The problem is, rather than getting nissan to mod the system to be able to tell us when we need to go for a good run, the regen cycle parameters should be modified so as to allow the computer to regen under all forms of good driving, rather than letting it build up to max limit.

Its like saying, Empty the bin when ever you get a chance, rather than waiting for it to get completely full before you take it outside, as it may not get done when its absolutely necessary.

If it comes down to driver error, I dont believe Nissan ever gave me a regimented timetable of driving styles. Its a cop out on their behalf.

---
2008 T31 TS Manual Turbo Diesel
"Bells and whistles"
27/Apr/2009, 6:50 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message
 
Apis1 Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

X-TRAIL NEWBIE
 


Date Registered: 02-2009
TOTAL POSTS: 29
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Particulate filter error resulting in MIL light


Dronus,
I applaud your approach to this problem which seems to be gathering other diesel powered Xtrails and will certainly be a issue for Nissan Australia and if not handled appropiately, eventual loss of sales.
 Put simply if you have had your long trip to Mexico (Victoria) last week and now the DPF has occurred againing something is still WRONG. The DPF warning plus 8.1 kmpl fuel consumption figure should be telling someone in service something useful! (That assumes a lot I know but with an good tech it will). Ie I think the ECU is trying for a regen! However after such a recent long trip! No sir its still wrong, wrong!
 Better still I have a theory Dronus. The input sensors sending info to the ECU, Ie the ANAlOGUE section that produces the information for the X+A flag one of them has to be incorrect.(Ie stuffed). Where they are on the soot filter and what type of sensor, I dont know but how they work as you have explained is on the possible blocked effect and value(s) sent to the ECU . Simply one will be at fault creating a greater differential value to the ECU(that is really there) ie enough to trigger the X+B flag. thus turning the dreaded DPF light on, and ruining Dronus' day by making him drive to Port Wakefield, dispite needing to go to somewhere else!
If only Nissan told you what parts they replaced when they did the service regen all would be known!
This vague , 'you dont need to know approach' leaves me with the impression that they (Nissan) are not sure at all and are hoping this will just go away, which it never does. )

Put simply give the information to the user especially if it results in an expensive regen process possibly taking 5 hours service plus parts...i'm guessing $500- $600.

If Nissan have to remove the time display to change it to DPF status so be it , (there is a clock on the radio) give me the raw analogue inputs from the A/D and i'm happy!..
The boys I work with have a very dim view of Nissan when it comes to support and urged me to get the VW. (I'm not sure VW would be that much better but they may have less technical issues)
Interestingly with the VW diesel Jetta you can access all the service information via the LCD screen by entering a service code. You can change minor calibration details ,fuel and distance etc etc if you know what your doing. Is this possible on our Xtrail? No!I spoke to Nissan service and the look of amazement and scorn when I spoke to them made me wonder if I was speaking Latin. The reply I got was 'not a single issue concerning DPF regeneration', the product has been well received with everyone happy with the perfomance and economy. Bye.

---
T31 Diesel manual, Bash Plate, Tow bar, Nudge, Bumper protectors, Tint, Roof racks, Rubbermats, Provented
27/Apr/2009, 7:48 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message
 
dronus Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

X-TRAIL LEGEND
 


Date Registered: 08-2008
Location: Adelaide
TOTAL POSTS: 541
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Particulate filter error resulting in MIL light


Thanks for all your replies. Logging these incidents online and in an open and accurate forum leaves a history which can be reviewed later.

Let me clarify one thing; The service guys did explain to me that the DPF regeneration process is a continuous process. This means that (as they explained it several times to me) so long as the speed, temperature and slight difference in pressures are met - the DPF will try and regenerate. Be it 5% or 65% blocked it will always try and regenerate to make it close to 0%. It doesn't wait until it is 60% blocked then try - it should be a continuous process. If it doesn't have time to completely regenerate because you slowed down, or something, it will try again when the conditions are once again met.

In my first post i mentioned that my DPF light came on, and then several minutes later the MIL light came on. There is no way that was long enough time to do a burn off or even give me a chance to make it to a 80kmph zone.. This morning when my DPF light came on i had been on the southern express way doing 100 - 80kmph and then dropped into peak traffic, averaging probably 35kmph from one side of Adelaide to the other. But this morning the MIL light did not come on - i made it all the way out to the other side of town, did a short run to just past Bolivar and the light went off. I wonder if in that distance it has cleared it to 0% or just to back below the trigger point of the DPF light coming on? I guess there is no way to know.

The car now runs really well, revving out and performing beautifully.

I agree that some other cars have alot more info in their displays some (even the blegh ford falcon spew) have RDS in their radios and all kinds of funky things. Nissan (like Toyota) follow the KISS principle and i guess you learn to accept that.

DPF status would be an excellent addition to the T31 Diesel instrument cluster - i will try to engage Nissan to constructively discuss the possibility of it being included in a software upgrade, or at the very least get some data on how the ECU reports the status increments so that a stand alone device can be engineered ( i know a few people who might like to do that task!) Also lowering the speed required to initiate a regen from 63kmph to 58kmph sounds like something that could be achieved in the short term to save alot of headaches.

I implore you to not take this thread as a reason to not buy a Diesel X-Trail. They are an awesome car. Take the Manual for a drive, you'll be hooked.

I have owned quite a few cars over the years, many of them i have bought new. After objectively and open-mindedly driving every car in the class on the market before purchasing my last 3 cars i still believe that the X-Trail represents excellent value for money, and very practical, tough useful car. Thats why i have bought 2 in a row!

This is a minor hurdle that Nissan will get over with feedback from us, the owners. Its a new platform in Australia, its bound to have minor bugs the first time around.

It could be worse - you could be driving a Mitsubishi !

Cheers,

Dronus

*edited spelling and clarification.

Last edited by dronus, 28/Apr/2009, 6:59 am


---
Current - GU Patrol
Old - '08 T31 Platinum TL Diesel Manual - Bells and whistles.
Older - '04 T30 Ti-L Auto
X-966
27/Apr/2009, 8:27 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message MSN
 
Jaali Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

X-TRAIL NEWBIE
 


Date Registered: 04-2009
TOTAL POSTS: 6
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Particulate filter error resulting in MIL light


Hi Again,
           I got the reply back for my question to Nissan. They asked me to get in touch with local Nissan Dealer for DPF questions. That is a very lousy way to handle a new customer or going to be customers questions! Dealers point to Nissan and Nissan to dealers not sure what to do here. But as people have mentioned here this issue will be ironed out soonner or later, but I would prefer to be at the later side than the earlier side. So will wait and watch this space before I eventually get a XTrail.

Although this technology is not new and has been proven overseas and almost all companies producing Diesel engines use it.

Cheers.
2/May/2009, 11:54 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message Blog
 
popeclement Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

X-TRAIL FANATIC
 


Date Registered: 07-2008
Location: Perth, WA
TOTAL POSTS: 476
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Particulate filter error resulting in MIL light


Dronus

Thanks for your updates on the problem you are having.

I have now done over 25000kms with no error lights or sluggishness from the motor.

It is slightly overdue for the 20000km service which I hope to have done soon. I will ask if they have seen any local WA issues with this.

As mentioned proviously consumption ranges up to 8.3 sometimes but I put that down to more stop/start and carrying load than the regen process. Freeway it drops down to 7.2.

I also believe your vehicle may still have an issue they have not resolved and you need to press them for further investigation to be carried out.

John



---
X-916, VW Golf 90TSi manual, limestone grey, no extras
2008 TL dc i, manual, twilight; full set bash plates, jaos strut bar
- traded
9/May/2009, 9:46 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message
 
fangios Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

X-TRAIL ENTHUSIAST
 


Date Registered: 08-2008
Location: Mornington Peninsula,Victoria
TOTAL POSTS: 104
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Particulate filter error resulting in MIL light


I also have never experienced any of these lights (thank goodness). My x-trail is about to hit 30,000kms and sits on an average of 7.2l/100km. I do probably do a 15 min run of 100kms several times a week, but mainly all Melbourne suburban driving.

It does also sound to me like something is still wrong with your car Dronus.

---
X-Trail TS DC-i 6 speed manual
Electric Blue, cargo barrier, tow bar, reverse sensors, Rhino heavy duty aero roof bars and baby seat!
11/May/2009, 10:28 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message
 
Jaali Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

X-TRAIL NEWBIE
 


Date Registered: 04-2009
TOTAL POSTS: 6
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Particulate filter error resulting in MIL light


Hi All,
           I appreciate the effort you all are putting in here and I am surprised that Nissan actually do not have a person on the forum. Most companies now prefer to get information out via Web, and have their people monitor the forum activities to look for comments that can cause disrepute. But as it has been said if enough nosie can be created it will be heard. Good luck in your efforts.
Cheers
12/May/2009, 9:03 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message Blog
 
Apis1 Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

X-TRAIL NEWBIE
 


Date Registered: 02-2009
TOTAL POSTS: 29
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Particulate filter error resulting in MIL light


Ok Before we go on, I love the DCI, but my wife (her car) is becoming confused.

Why, because I say (the xtrail) has been on a long trip say 300kms and above and an avg 100kmph and it should be ok,re DPF , however the dreaded DPF light comes on after only LESS than 100kms of city work. (Recent development) As I have stated in an earlier post its only a matter of time until the MIL comes on and i'm pretty sure the DPF 'thing' is getting more blocked and we are only at 9500kms total. The city work is very bad however! lots of crawling! approx 5kms 15 mins
So the issue is VERY simple.

Why are we always going to places that FIX the warning after what appears recent long trips? ANS is the regen ok? Not sure but when we do go above 80 kms the bloody light goes out soooo!

Is the fuel appropriate. ANS Using BP Utimate but only recent SA 1 Month so unsure!?Is the Ceramic DPF already blocked. Status Unknown
Is the removal of soot complying with the requirements of the ECU? ANS Completely unsure but alarm occurs generally after a good night at approx 1.00Am when wife driving and conversation goes 'what is this yellow symbol mean'? SORRY just thought I should Tell YOU something unusual on the Instrumentsl!!!
Best bit is you are trying to plan how to get the trail above 7o kph while also delivering everyone to their sporting requirements, so yes Jali your'e correct ,if your'e doing more than say 30% city driving and at that less than 50kph then get PETROL.

  Never thought it would be such a problem given all the diesels i've owned but the DPF has changed all that. Some VW 2.0 GTI are in trouble as well, PLSE check VW watercooled discussion look for DPF issues.
It's a bloody mess and to all those who don't have any trouble good luck, lets find out , other than frequent long trips what is different!! I've convinced the DPF is at fault but can't prove it.
The other thing, I reckon the assumption that 'working' the motor around town to help keep the DPF clean is wrong. Simply you are creating more particulates under heavy take off so they need future removal which requires high motor temp plus speed . I have been doing this without overdoing it and now reckon i've missed the point of the DPF.
Nissan have been VERY quiet so far so you guys are the only users that appear reliable in this HUGE debate.
 I'm certain Dronus your'e correct re new platform but i'm not a happy camper re changing soot filters (DPF) to comply with Euro specs re smog every 10thouskms. Cheers Mark

Edit following day, After morning visit to Nissan Service.
I have posted an update following this mornings visit to Nissan to give everyone an update and hopefully save time.
Seems they have now had another xtrail with similar kms and 'problems' as ours. They completed an oil flush plus 4 hour regen to clear the DPF which was choked and could not clean itself on long drives dispite the regen from the ECU working . (the driver was using the good diesel apparently). The service guy reckons that taking ours for the long trips is a waste of time as they beleive the factory oil MAY be the problem? If this is the case shouldn't Nissan be contacting all users and get the oil changed ASAP? Even though the MIL has not appeared they want to do the regen on ours if the DPF is also blocked. Is that a good idea guys? I've asked for a tech thread to be raised on this issue when it comes in. Service want to put in Castrol low ash something at $16.80 per litre and reckon that this will solve the issue. They expect DPF issues to occur at about 30,000 kms, not 10,000kms. They are suddenly seeing DPF problems across the range with a couple of Dual cab utes taking days to fix! They think because of incorrect motor lubricant!

With our trail they want to print out everything and send it to Nissan. They will require the trail for a couple of days possibly to allow for a difficult regen. What do you guys think? I'm out of ideas at this point.
 



Last edited by Apis1, 13/May/2009, 1:05 pm


---
T31 Diesel manual, Bash Plate, Tow bar, Nudge, Bumper protectors, Tint, Roof racks, Rubbermats, Provented
13/May/2009, 12:08 am Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message
 
cartsT31 Profile
Live feed
Blog
Friends
Miscellaneous info

X-TRAIL NEWBIE
 


Date Registered: 09-2008
Location: Kings Park, NSW
TOTAL POSTS: 28
Reply | QUOTE
Re: Particulate filter error resulting in MIL light


Do you know which oil Nissan are running in your xtrail?

I had a very frustrating experience with Nissan when I first bought the xtrail. I rang 3 dealers and each of them told me something different in regards to the oil I needed to run in the car. Eventually, one of them referred to a technical publication that was very specific about the oil that needed to be run.

In short, if the technician working on your vehicle isnt clued up, there is a very good chance they have used the wrong spec oil in your service and have blocked your DPF. It wouldn't be the first time, and Im sure it wont be the last.



---
2008 T31 TS Manual Turbo Diesel
"Bells and whistles"
15/May/2009, 8:23 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message
 


Reply




Page:
 1  2  3 ... 5  6  7  8  9 ... 23  24  25 





You are not logged in (login)

forum sticker
Back to top Back to top

Back to top

<-- end container -->