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jalalski Profile
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Date Registered: 02-2004
Location: SUTHERLAND, SYDNEY
TOTAL POSTS: 29094
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Re: HUB Separating from Axle


Sorry to hear that Geoff. Were the symptoms the same as mentioned here and if so, how come you didn't catch it any sooner?

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15/Nov/2007, 3:52 pm Link to this post Send Private Message MSN Blog
 
GeoffM Profile
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Date Registered: 07-2004
Location: Sydney
TOTAL POSTS: 258
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Re: HUB Separating from Axle


quote:

jalalski wrote:

Sorry to hear that Geoff. Were the symptoms the same as mentioned here and if so, how come you didn't catch it any sooner?



The symptoms were that about 2 weeks ago my wife said she thought she heard something scraping against the wheel when cornering. I went for a drive and never heard a thing.
But last weekend as I was driving it and noticed it myself. Only at about 60km, sweeping left-handers. Next day it was gone again.
We took it to the local mechanic yesterday to see what he thought.

I hadnt read about this on the forum until now. Our local mechanic said he had done it before on an xtrail....and he only really services the suburb.. he's not a big operator.

Just from reading this thread, could it be a common post 100,000km issue for xtrails ?


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15/Nov/2007, 4:12 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message Blog
 
jalalski Profile
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Date Registered: 02-2004
Location: SUTHERLAND, SYDNEY
TOTAL POSTS: 29094
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Re: HUB Separating from Axle


quote:

GeoffM wrote:
Just from reading this thread, could it be a common post 100,000km issue for xtrails ?



Dunno Geoff, I guess I have another 10,000kms to find out emoticon (fingers crossed)

I did check all of the hub locking pins and they all seem to be in place and hub nuts are all tight as well.


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Dunoon Profile
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Date Registered: 06-2005
Location: Orange, NSW
TOTAL POSTS: 269
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Re: HUB Separating from Axle


I have watched this thread with interest and read the numbers of criticism of Nissan for its alleged bad design.

However, I believe it is a very different design to what we are used to, and not necessarily bad.

All my previous experience with front wheel bearings with rear wheel drive cars is as follows: The lock nut is tightened to a recommended degree, then always BACKED OFF a certain amount in order to have some slack to allow for expansion etc. The locking clip and split pin are then inserted to stop the nut coming off because the nut is in fact loose - with many cars no more than finger tight. (The nut has had a reverse threat on it also). I recall that in most cases the workshop manuals warn against over tightening. In most cases they used tapered bearings with this set up.

The X-trail has a very different set up, probably because it is front wheel drive. The nut is tightened up very tightly and is left tight (it may have a reverse thread also). The split pin is only a safeguard as the very tight (over 200 ft lbs) nut is what keeps the wheel on. The clearance between the nut and the split pin is of no consequence and is necessary. The bearing used with this I believe would not be tapered.

The Nissan or other mechanics who express wonderment are only displaying their own ignorance in my view.

I accept that for some reason a few have come loose but that may well be mistakes made by mechanics because of their own ignorance or carelessness.

It is very unjust to blame either Nissan or the X-trail for faulty design, because it is not, just different.

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16/Nov/2007, 3:00 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message MSN Blog
 
jalalski Profile
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Date Registered: 02-2004
Location: SUTHERLAND, SYDNEY
TOTAL POSTS: 29094
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Re: HUB Separating from Axle


Sorry John,

But when I have discussed the xtrail set-up with my mechanic (and he wasn't the only one I asked about this) he had another front wheel drive sitting there and our set-up is no where near as secure as the other car which had a locking crown on top of the hub nut and the securing pin going through leaving no room whatsoever for the hub nut to come loose. I see no point in having this gap there in the first place and it serves no purpose to my knowledge.

The comparison in this thread wasn't done with rear wheel drive vehicles, rather with front wheel drive like ours.

Last edited by jalalski, 16/Nov/2007, 3:31 pm


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FLY00A Profile
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Date Registered: 12-2006
TOTAL POSTS: 37
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Re: HUB Separating from Axle


Hi guys.

This post has me VERY concerned to say the least.

My car has started making this weird rubbing whurring noise again...

Does this hub separation only happen on the fronts? Or can it also happen on the rears?

Nissan has got to have some kind of recall for this...this is a MAJOR safety issue. My wife and kids are in the X-Trail everyday...its just something you can not risk.

Oscar

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20/Nov/2007, 9:18 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message MSN
 
GeoffM Profile
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Date Registered: 07-2004
Location: Sydney
TOTAL POSTS: 258
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Re: HUB Separating from Axle



The mechanic diagnosed my hub/bearing issue by jacking up the wheel off the ground, and seeing if he could physically make it wobble by pushing against it.

But, by the time it gets to this stage, it may be already broken.

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21/Nov/2007, 1:06 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message Blog
 
jalalski Profile
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Date Registered: 02-2004
Location: SUTHERLAND, SYDNEY
TOTAL POSTS: 29094
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Re: HUB Separating from Axle


Hi Guys,

I have discussed this issue with Nissan and received the following explanation:

The hub nut will and can only come loose if the bearings are damaged or on their way out. They have confirmed that they have received cases with loose hub nuts, but in all cases the wheel bearing was damaged which caused the hub nut to turn.

The xtrail bearing seem to be the weakest point and in particular, the front bearings, it almost guaranteed that the bearings will have problems when you get to around 120,000kms and would need to be replaced. (this my view on this and not Nissan's)

I suggest that you pay close attention to any grinding noises and if in doubt, jack up the exy and check the wheels for any wobble or looseness, if any of these factors are present, don't delay having it inspected, as what could end-up costing you around $100 for a bearing, may well stretch to $600 for the entire hub.

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Revhead Kev Profile
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Date Registered: 10-2006
Location: Mona Vale, Sydney, AUSTRALIA
TOTAL POSTS: 6004
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Re: HUB Separating from Axle


quote:

jalalski wrote:
They have confirmed that they have received cases with loose hub nuts, but in all cases the wheel bearing was damaged which caused the hub nut to turn.



Normally the tight nut rests against the bearing lower race and the upper race turns freely.
So, the grinding noise first heard could be the outer race of the bearing, rubbing on the hub nut and starting to cause it to turn and loosen.

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21/Nov/2007, 8:05 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message Blog
 
GeoffM Profile
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Date Registered: 07-2004
Location: Sydney
TOTAL POSTS: 258
Reply | QUOTE
Re: HUB Separating from Axle


quote:

jalalski wrote:

Hi Guys,

I have discussed this issue with Nissan and received the following explanation:

The hub nut will and can only come loose if the bearings are damaged or on their way out. They have confirmed that they have received cases with loose hub nuts, but in all cases the wheel bearing was damaged which caused the hub nut to turn.

The xtrail bearing seem to be the weakest point and in particular, the front bearings, it almost guaranteed that the bearings will have problems when you get to around 120,000kms and would need to be replaced. (this my view on this and not Nissan's)

I suggest that you pay close attention to any grinding noises and if in doubt, jack up the exy and check the wheels for any wobble or looseness, if any of these factors are present, don't delay having it inspected, as what could end-up costing you around $100 for a bearing, may well stretch to $600 for the entire hub.



Thats a good summary. My mechanic first suspected the bearing to have gone, but once he took it apart realised the faulty bearing had damaged the hub. Bearing replacement including labour was going to be around $200. Hub + bearing replacement was $600.

I'd be interested to hear of any case where a faulty bearing didnt cause hub damage, as once the bearing goes it's metal on metal and you'd only need a few km of that to do irreperable damage (I'd guess).

Also, Our xtrail went in for its 110,000 km service on a month before this bearing trouble, so normal servicing may not catch it.




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