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Army1 Profile
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Date Registered: 11-2010
TOTAL POSTS: 11
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T31 Intercooler experiment


Hi,
    I have started a little test to establish if the T31 intercooler is adequate for the job or needs to be uprated, with the ultimate goal of efficiency not peak power. I have placed 4 temperature sensors on the intake system and 4 readouts in the cab. Sensor 1 on the turbo intake outlet, sensor 2 intercooler inlet, sensor 3 intercooler outlet and sensor 4 on the throttle body.

The thermometers are cheap units from china, some initial testing in the garage shows a 0.3 degree variation between the four from 10 to 30 degrees. I had to add some wire to the probe length so I tried to add the same length to the two intercooler probes to get a closer read at the intercooler. The added wire moves the ambient temp up by 1 or 2 degrees. The probe wires can also collect radiant heat from the engine bay. All of these things considered the temps should be +1.5 at the intercooler and +3 at the other two with an overall of +/- 2 degrees. Pics so far.

Sensor placement

http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m513/brettarm/turboout.jpg
http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m513/brettarm/interin.jpg
http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m513/brettarm/interout.jpg
http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m513/brettarm/Body.jpg

Gage readouts. First before engine start for ambient read.

http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m513/brettarm/zerostart.jpg

While driving at 100Kph on flat road.

http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m513/brettarm/middriving.jpg

After idling for 5mins like in traffic.

http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m513/brettarm/endidle.jpg

I will test some more conditions soon.

Last edited by Army1, 5/Oct/2011, 7:33 am
4/Oct/2011, 4:18 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message Blog
 
MrMez Profile
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Date Registered: 03-2011
TOTAL POSTS: 124
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Re:


LOL. That is so ghetto.

Interesting numbers. Shows the thing really works.

If its efficiency you have in mind, I'm sure Nissan/Renault are spot on.
Sure a bigger cooler will give you more power assuming you have a boost controller, but will also increase lag. Not such an issue for auto's where the power never really goes off during gear changes, but for manuals... every time your change gears you loose all that boost and have to build it up again.
Again, not so much an issue if you click through the gears fast and keep the revs high, but not exactly the driving they built the car and engine for.

The only way to keep the well balanced boost vs lag characteristic of the 2.0 DCI by changing the intercooler, is find a new one with the same internal volume, but with better heat dissipation, which usually means more weight. Even then, it will cost you thousands and as the max boost is limited to ~1.0 Bar, they only improvement will be a very minor reduction in lag.

If you want more power get a diesel chip or boost controller. If you want better intercooler efficiency install an intercooler water sprayer, like they had on older WRX emoticon
4/Oct/2011, 6:47 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message Blog
 
cooch t31 Profile
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Date Registered: 06-2008
Location: Blue Mountains, NSW
TOTAL POSTS: 5966
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Re:


Cool nice to see real time figures as your driving.
Does the scan gauge show you temperatures as well or just what the ECU is reading?

Last edited by cooch t31, 5/Oct/2011, 5:39 am


---
Tony X-891c

HERE is my D22 Navara
HERE is my old 2008 T31, ST Series1

5/Oct/2011, 5:35 am Link to this post Send Private Message
 
Army1 Profile
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Date Registered: 11-2010
TOTAL POSTS: 11
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Re: T31 Intercooler experiment


quote:

cooch t31 wrote: Does the scan gauge show you temperatures as well or just what the ECU is reading?



The scan gauge only shows the air intake temp from the ECU and the dash shows ambient temp. This is a good way to get a zero of the other meters and see how the intake temp has a flow on effect with the rest of the intake system.

quote:

MrMez wrote: If you want more power get a diesel chip or boost controller. If you want better intercooler efficiency install an intercooler water sprayer, like they had on older WRX



Diesel common rail chips only over pressurize the rail and trick the ECU into a rich mix.
The M9R doesn't have a boost controller as it doesn't have a waste-gate, it's a VGT.
Water sprayers are good for short runs but not for towing on a long trip.

Yes a higher volume system would increase lag but as stock there are 3 rubber hoses that could be changed for metal pipes to decrease the flexing=lag on boost. There is a 810x200x90 Eclipse Plymouth Laser intercooler(VS stock 800X170X65) that would fit very nicely for $375AU plus a few hoses and clamps for for a few hundred. I have access to a workshop to make brackets too. So it should cost well less than $1000 for the whole job if it's needed.




Last edited by Army1, 5/Oct/2011, 2:53 pm
5/Oct/2011, 8:52 am Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message Blog
 
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Date Registered: 11-2010
TOTAL POSTS: 11
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Re: T31 Intercooler experiment


It rained on the way to work so I had the camera ready for some more intercooler testing. The first photo is just after the engine was turned on to get a zero of the meters.

http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m513/brettarm/wetstart.jpg

The second photo is taken at 100kph after going up a small hill with heavy rain on a 12degree morning.

http://i1129.photobucket.com/albums/m513/brettarm/wethot.jpg

As you can see the outlet of the intercooler is about 8degrees hotter then ambient with the extra cooling effect of water and only a small hill. I would like to see the temps when it's a 30degree day towing up a big hill.

Last edited by Army1, 6/Oct/2011, 1:45 pm
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Date Registered: 09-2011
Location: Brisbane
TOTAL POSTS: 12
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Re:


Awesome experiment.

Have you considered putting insulation over the sensors? Something pretty dense to keep the wind away from the probes.

You had to add extra wire for the correct length? Are the temperature sensors Thermocouples or RTDs? This is where it gets a bit complicated, particularly for thermocouples. If you are joining wires that are made of the exact same type metal as the wire in the probe then it's all fine. If not, then you are also measuring the temperate at the join as well! Read here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermocouple.

The length of the cables is a factor, but is less important than the joins in the cable.

tltr; put all of the wire joints at same place, at the same temperature. Use the same type cable for all extensions. Put a join in every cable (even if you don't need the length).

Barry.

---
----------------
2011 TL Auto, Silver
Tow Bar, Tint and Body Side Mouldings
7/Oct/2011, 9:17 am Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message Blog
 
Army1 Profile
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Date Registered: 11-2010
TOTAL POSTS: 11
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Re: T31 Intercooler experiment


Thanks for the feedback, I understand the values are out but they are not out by too much. This is why I always take a cold photo to establish a zero point for each test. I'm looking for large temperature diffrancees so a few degrees won't hurt the results.
8/Oct/2011, 8:24 pm Link to this post Send Email PM   Send Private Message Blog
 


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